Yep, just messin around. I like the flavor of Desem so much, and Motherdough is beyond great, that I thought I would combine them. I started out the night before baking, with a preferment, using Desem combined with water/flour/etc. I set it out overnight at room temperature and next morning it looked like this:
Then I added some Motherdough which, if you didn’t know, is just using a vigorous starter kept at 80% hydration (for me anyway) and refrigerated(it developes the flavor). The motherdough looked like this:
I added more water, flour, salt, some oil and came up with a nice dough which only took three hours to ferment, although I let it go four. It then looked like this after bulk fermentation:
It was a little on the sticky side, but I shaped up the loaves and weighed them out at just over 2 lbs each and then put them to proof in bannetons:
The proofing rate slowed a bit and they took 2.5 hours to proof and really needed 3, but I was running out of time before I needed to make dinner. So…. here is the first loaf:
(Sorry about the poor quality of pics, no sun outside, and poor lighting inside. I still need a lightbox or something).
The second loaf I baked a little hotter as the first one came out a bit light:
The third loaf:
Here are some pics of the crumb:
The bread flavor is really great! It is a very nice tangy sour. The crust was wonderful, crusty and crispy. This was altogether a great marriage between two great flavored starters. I got the idea of using Desem starter as a flavoring because the Whole Wheat tastes so terrific after fermenting with Desem, I thought it would interesting to use it as the flavoring besides adding another vigorous starter as a complement. I really am having so much fun baking with sourdough. I love experimenting and doing off the wall things with it. I also baked another Soft Sourdough a couple of days ago using Desem again as a flavoring. It came out wonderful and makes terrific sandwiches and toast. I haven’t had a lot of time for posting though. If you notice carefully behind the pictures of the bread, the walls are barren and the wallpaper is ripped off. I am redoing the room by repainting the ceiling and wallpapering. Then comes the carpet. So you see, even though I am still baking, I am extra busy! If I get a chance, I will post about the soft sourdough, if I don’t …. I will continue on…. till next baking day,
I haven’t been able to find the time to post the San Francisco Bread recipe, that I did earlier, to the Special Recipes folder yet. However, I did make the batch again using the same recipe. I decided to call the recipe San Francisco Sunrise Loaf. I came out really well again, I am very happy with how vigorous the dough turns out. I make up a mixture of the preferment the night before and it contains quite a bit of the resulting dough. I let it ferment overnight at room temperature and next morning it is so bubbly and smells terrific! I then put it into the mixer and added the rest of the ingredients. After making the dough and letting it bulk ferment for four hours the dough was doubled. It was a fast ferment. Here is the dough ready to shape:
I divided the dough into three pieces and they weighed just over 2 lbs each:
I then shaped the dough into loaves and put them into the couche:
I let the dough proof for two hours this time instead of putting the loaves back into the refrigerator overnight like I did the first time. Then I baked the dough and got three nice loaves of sourdough:
Here is loaf 1:
Loaf 2 :
Loaf 3 :
Here is a closeup of loaf 1 :
Here is the crumb:
This bread is really nice. It has an open fluffy crumb, wonderful flavor and the crust is very crispy, crusty. I am really liking this recipe. I especially like the way the dough is so invigorated by the preferment, the dough is so bubbly that it is somewhat hard to shape and get all of the big bubbles out of. I have had a great time eating slices with butter, it is soooooo good!
I mixed up a batch of sourdough using my Australian Sourdough Starter. This starter is my husband’s very favorite flavored starter besides the motherdough breads. I decided to use the Two Night Super Sour recipe but make it a one night instead. Well I ended up changing the flour in the recipe too.
In the evening:
I started with 2 cups of vigorous Australian Starter at 166% hydration (one cup flour to one cup water).
2 cups of warm water
1 cup Rye flour
1 cup Whole Wheat flour
2 cups Bread flour
I mixed this together as a sponge and let it set at room temperature overnight.
Next morning I added the prefermented mixture to my mixer and then added:
1 cup warm water
2 Tablespoons Oil
5 teaspoons salt
5 cups Bread flour (approximately)
I mixed the ingredients together and then let the dough rest for 15 minutes. I then kneaded the dough for an additional three minutes. The dough was doubled in 6 hours. I then had my daughter shape the loaves because I was very busy working on my car. I came back in to check on how she had done and realized something I had not considered before. I took it for granted that she knew how to shape loaves. She didn’t. She had basically gotten them into shape enough to put into the bannetons. The dough was flat in the baskets. Almost like it had been poured in. So I took out the dough and showed her how to shape the loaves so that the loaves had an outer skin of dough pulled around the outside and pinched together to form like a casing so that the bread could raise itself up and not turn out flat. If you don’t know how to do this, get some good books on baking which will show you. Jefferey Hamelman’s book on bread comes to mind, he has some great illustrations showing how to shape loaves.
Anyway, the loaves were reshaped and placed in banneton baskets:
The shaped loaves raised for two hours and then slashed and baked:
The loaves were two large loaves weighing over two lbs each. They came out great!
Here is the first one:
Here is the crumb for the first loaf:
Here is the second loaf:
This dough was easy to handle and not too sticky. The crust texture and color came out really great. The crumb is soft and open, and the flavor, as always, is unspeakably delicious. Australian Sourdough starter has an old world flavor that is hard to describe. It is also nicely sour.
Sometimes it seems as if you just can’t get the “sour” you want out of your starters. Yes, last Summer there was no problem, now it takes more work to get a good sour flavor. I am not sure why this is myself, I wonder if it is just the overall cooler temperatures of flour, starter, house and some people bake less, so the starter is left in the refrigerator most of the time. When I leave my motherdough starter in the refrigerator all of the time, it is a sweeter, fuller wheat flavor, definately not a more sour flavor.
Anyway, I have been working with the San Francisco starter and decided to try and coax the sour from it. I have been having moderately sour breads coming from this starter, and really great flavor and vigor. I started with a thicker preferment and fermented it for 18 hours keeping it at around 70 – 72 degrees. It looked like this:
I then mixed in te rest of the ingredients and let the dough ferment for four more hours and then shaped the dough:
Then I put the loaves into the refrigerator overnight for 12 hours. I couldn’t get too many pictures of the process as one of my sons was using my camera to make “Lego movies” and the camera was taped down! Anyway, next morning I took out the loaves and staggered them so they would bake at different times. I had five loaves at not quite 1.5 lbs each. Here are the results:
I sliced the one which didn’t get a good oven spring so we could try it out, it was the only one that came out a bit on the flattish side, here is the crumb:
I made the loaves on the small side so I could share with neighbors and friends as I have been getting a few hints lately 🙂 The bread came out with a terrific texture and already has a sharp taste even though the sour usually takes a couple of hours of cooling to develop completely. Although I feel the experiment with timing was successful, I do think it was at its limit. It did take a lot of high heat to get a good color with me keeping the oven at 450 longer than usual and I noticed that some of the crust was trying to tear in places, if you look closely you can see this. The dough was also more sticky than usual for the stage and hydration it was at. I think the gluten was right at the limit of trying to break down. I am thinking of doing the initial preferment at 12 hours at a warm temperature instead of 18 to see what the outcome would be. It seems to me that if you want to control the “sour” more, you might need a proofing box to help you keep the temperatures at a steady predictable warmth.
Pane Teresa bread is so good! I love this bread. It is so unique… it is made differently than other breads. When you are done, you have a flat piece of dough…which transforms into a light fluffy loaf full of holes. It starts like this:
The motherdough that is used is very active and full of bubbles, if it isn’t, you won’t make good bread.
Then you mix up the dough and let it set overnight, this is after mixing and before Autolyse:
This is after Autolyse and final mixing:
The dough is refrigerated overnight and taken out the next day to warm up. It is then divided. I divided it into three pieces which weighed almost 2 lbs each.
The dough is very wettish and hard to work with. Here is a closeup of the dough resting in preparation for shaping:
The dough is then shaped and placed into Bannetons:
They then proof for two hours. I put one of the loaves onto the cool porch to slow it down so all of the loaves wouldn’t be ready to bake at the same time. I also preheated the oven for a long time. The house was cold anyway, so I gave it a good two hours. I had layered two baking stones together for a lot of heat when the dough was placed on the stone.
Here is the first loaf, it didn’t reach the full potential that the next loaf did:
The next loaf was larger although the same weight:
Here are the two together:
Here is the third loaf, it turned out magnificent:
This is the crumb from the second loaf:
Here are all of the loaves together:
The fragrance of this bread is heavenly! The crumb is soft and moist, the crust crisp and crackly. This is a really terrific loaf to bake up and always a surprise when it springs up in the oven and is so full of holes!
I started a preferment the day before yesterday with my Desem starter, but had to go into town yesterday so I wasn’t able to mix it up and bake. Instead, I took out my preferment and did a build on it adding half again the amount of dough I had. Then I put it into the cold pantry overnight. In the morning it was very light and airy. So I put it in the mixer and doubled the weight of the preferment making about four lbs of dough. The dough was light and spongy after four hours, and had risen higher than any of my other Desem doughs so far. So I shaped it and put it in the couche:
Boy did we have a full kitchen today. It was hard to fit in the bread baking schedule. My daughter made cream puffs and potato croissants (boyfriend coming over). I had to put my Desem loaves on the top of the stove to get some warmth and I put a wet cloth over the loaves. One of the loaves actually had the top crust(which was turned upside down) heat up, dry out and stick to the cloche, which never happened before. I had to spray it with water to get it off and then I noticed the outside layer, which was touching the stovetop through the couche, was actually a bit cooked! I decided to slice down through the middle to try to save the loaf. It actually came out pretty nice:
The lighter color on the top of the crust is where the dough dried and cooked.
The next loaf was also dried out on the top crust from the heat of sitting on top of the stove and stuck to the couche. I was able to peel off the couche and get the loaf onto the stone. I also made one long lengthwise slice on the top of the loaf to try to save the loaf. I don’t think any other slices would have worked as the whole top crust was dried out and somewhat cooked. I didn’t realize it was that hot on top of the stove when I set the loaves on a grate on top of the couche on the stovetop. But we had been using the stove for hours and it was just hotter than I realized. It also came out nice anyway:
Here are the two finished:
I don’t have any crumb pictures yet, but will tomorrow. They are still too hot to slice!
I am so glad I tried Desem bread. I never knew Whole Wheat bread could taste so good! It is moist, chewy, with a hard to describe full fermented wheat flavor of toasted wheat and maltiness. There is no added malt, but you sure taste it, especially when you toast the bread. My children that don’t usually like Whole Wheat bread (most of them) love the Desem bread. It never fails to be tasty and wonderfully sour!
Today I baked up a lower hydration dough using the San Francisco starter. I made a preferment from a motherdough of 80% hydration and let it set for 18 hours.
Then I added more flour and water to the batch and fermented it 6 more hours. After that I added the salt and rest of the flour and water and mixed it to a somewhat stiff (for me) dough.
I let this set for two hours to raise and then put it into the refrigerator overnight. In the morning I let the dough warm up for two hours, shaped, proofed and baked.
Here is the first loaf:
Here is the second loaf:
I used the roasting lid again to obtain a superior crust. It worked great! You could hear the crackle of the crust as it cooled. The batch is a great success with a terrific flavor and crisp crust. I served it with fresh butter and Turkey soup.
Here is a picture of the crumb which I took the next day. It is a lower hydration dough, so not too holey:
Well, here it is…. my best San Francisco Sourdough Bread ever!
But I am getting ahead of my story!
It started like this… I took out my San Francisco Starter from the refrigerator and warmed it up and fed it for several days. My last blog was on trying a SF technique from the manager of the Boudin Bakery of San Francisco. I felt that the starter I prefermented was too warm for too long and so I decided to do a shorter preferment at 72 degrees. I kept my eye on it and when it was super bubbly and doubled, I went ahead and mixed up the dough. I then let the dough ferment for another four hours at which time I shaped the loaves and put them into the refrigerator overnight:
Next morning I took out the dough and let proof for two hours:
I had shaped one batard style loaf and two boules, they were two lbs 2 oz each.
After two hours proofing and one hour preheating my oven, I baked the first loaf:
It came out pretty nice with a great crust and the crumb is nice too. Then I baked the second loaf which was a boule:
It came out okay, but I wanted a better color to the crust and bloom to the slashes. So I decided to take out my large roasting lid used for the Turkey pan and preheat it and use it to cover the last loaf:
What was neat is that the bread was still slid onto the stone first, sprayed once, and then covered by the lid. I had heated up the oven to 500 degrees. As soon as I had placed the lid and shut the door, I turned down the oven to 425 degrees and left the lid on for 15 minutes. After the fifteen minutes were up, I took off the lid and turned the loaf around. It already looked awesome! Here it is all finished:
Well, anyway, as you can see, the color is terrific! The crust is also wonderfully chewy, and crispy. There are some drawbacks for me to baking in a pot, although I do like it. I must say, there are no drawbacks to the lid method, at least I haven’t found any yet! Having the loaf sit right on the stone and have the close steam generated by the lid covering it, has given me one terrific San Francisco Sourdough Loaf!
Here is the crumb:
I will write up the technique and recipe and put it into the Special Recipe folder. Have a great day baking sourdough, I know I did!
I was trying to obtain some results the same as Boudin Bakery, which as everyone knows is the most famous Sourdough Bakery probably in the world. Anyway, I then used the starter the next day and mixed up a batch of dough using the recipe provided. Except that I often like to hold out on using the salt until after the Autolyse or rest period for the dough. So I made up the dough and did Autolyse. The dough was looking great. It had that just perfect feel to it. I then added the salt and stirred down the dough with the mixer. Shock! Disbelief! Before my very eyes, the dough fell apart and turned into a gooey mess! I did not mix for more than four minutes, so I knew I hadn’t overmixed. I had made a batch earlier in the week that did the same thing right after I added the salt which was Morton Iodized Salt by the way. Now I don’t know if it was the salt or the prefermented stage of warming the starter or what actually caused this gooey mess. The earlier batch I had made was so bad it had to be thrown out. I decided to save the present ruined batch until tomorrow and see if I could do anything with it, so I refrigerated it. Next, I decided to try again, but instead of using a starter which was kept warm for 24 hours, I used my motherdough which I always feed and keep in the refrigerator at 80% hydration. I mixed up the batch using the exact same recipe, only using the motherdough and a different salt this time. I had some sea salt which is what I used. After autolyse, I added the salt and the dough was wonderful.The only problem was that I now had two large bowls of dough at around 6 lbs each as I had quadrupled the recipe. Tweleve pounds altogether, approximately.
I left them out in the cold pantry which was around 40 degrees (yes, we have snow and ice laying out in the yard in Coastal Washington ! ) overnight. Next morning I brought the first ruined batch in to let it warm up. It was all full of bubbles and looked very active. Once it warmed up I poured it out and folded it a couple of times to see if I could build some strength in the gluten. It ended up feeling like a Ciabatta dough around 75 – 80 percent hydration.
I kept it well covered in flour and decided to shape some Ciabatta loaves with it. What could I lose? My other alternative was to throw it away anyway! So I shaped it like Ciabatta and got four nice sized loaves weighing approximately 1.5 lbs each:
I was very unsure what would happen to this dough, as it may have acted like an 75% hydration dough, but it had a lot more flour in it than a dough at 75& would have.
I proofed the loaves for 2 hours and baked them and here is what I got:
The interior was not at all holey:
Here are the rest:
Believe it or not the bread was scrumptious! I got raves on it. I served it buttered with broiled Ling Cod and mixed veggies.
Now onto the next batch which I had taken out of the cold room an hour after the other bowl of ruined dough and was working with alongside with. Here is how nice the dough in the second batch looked:
It was soft, bubbly and terrific dough to handle. I divided into three pieces and shaped the loaves which I placed in a couche:
I let this dough proof while the first dough was baking. When the other dough was done and it was ready I baked them one by one. Here are all three loaves finished:
I was trying to obtain a bread similar to the Boudin Bakery bread. I was asked if my starters could make bread like theirs. I went to their site and looked up “Boudin” and that is how I found the recipe and technique. I also signed up to be a customer as I thought it would be great to have some sent in the mail to see what it really tasted and looked like. No go for me. At around 30.00 for two loaves, once they figured in shipping, it was too steep a price for me! I will have to visit them someday when I head on down the Coast and pick up a loaf or two! So I still don’t know if I even approached near to their quality, but I aspire to do so, as I am sure many sourdough bakers do. Here is a closeup of the crust on one of my loaves:
Here is a picture of the crumb:
I was surprised at how similar this recipe turned out to be to my own Basic White recipe. It made me feel like I am on the right track. Anyway, the second batch of bread turned out very delicious, with a chewy, crisp, crust and soft, holey crumb. Any bread made with the motherdough smells super, out of this world wonderful.
So this is the tale of two batches of dough, mixed up on the same day, following the same recipe and two VERY different results. This is a good lesson on, “If you follow a recipe and don’t get the same results as the author, don’t always blame the recipe,”(or the author as a matter of fact). Have a great day trying to bake the best sourdough ever!
My last two batches of Desem were pretty different. The Desem starter is now very stable and reliable so I thought I might try experimenting with it a bit. Last week I made a batch of the more traditional Desem recipe which is in Laurel’s Bread Book. The dough is raising higher and the malt flavor of the wheat is very pronounced, not to mention how wonderfully sour it is EVERY time. I didn’t put any malt in the dough at all for the first batch but the fermenting of the Whole Wheat made the dough taste like malt, especially when toasted. I started with about 3.5 lbs of dough:
This doesn’t look like over 3 lbs of dough , but it was. I made this dough from the preferment of the starter from the night before. I then let it bulk ferment for four hours at which time I took the dough out of the bowl and shaped it and then put it into small bannetons:
While looking at this picture, I remembered the first time I tried Desem and my dough was a wet mess and I tried putting it into the bannetons and how terribly the dough stuck and ruined my bread! The dough was then placed in the warm oven ( I turned on the oven to 200 degrees long enough to warm up the baking stone and then turned the oven off and kept it cracked open) and covered with a wet tea towel to keep it humid:
I proofed it for two hours, taking the dough out of the oven after one hour so I could heat the oven and placing the dough on a rack on top of the warm oven with the dough still covered. Here is my result:
Next I decided to try to use my Desem starter to bake up some lighter bread made with 1/2 bread flour. I also decided to use a regular loaf pan for baking. I used 2 cups of Desem prefermented from the night before and followed pretty much the same schedule as the last Desem dough, four hours bulk ferment and two hours proofing. I missed with the two hours proofing though, although the dough felt ready, it really needed another 1/2 hour or more to proof. Here is the dough proofed and ready to shape:
I shaped the dough like a regular loaf where you fold over the ends and then fold over lengthwise, pinching the dough together with the heel of your hand. I then placed the dough into loaf pans:
The dough felt proofed enough, so I poked a couple of holes into the top as suggested in Laurel’s Bread Book. It is supposed to keep the top crust from separating from the rest of the loaf.
I wasn’t satisfied with it though, so I also slashed and then I baked the loafs at 450 degrees for five minutes, spraying several times, and turned the oven down to 400 degrees and baked another 40 minutes, turning halfway. Here are the loaves:
When the bread came out I waited for it to cool a little, and then I spread butter all over the loaves to help make the crust soft and chewy(this was supposed to be a softer Desem). As you can see, I needed to allow the dough to proof longer. I think with the added bread flour, I needed not only to let the dough raise longer but maybe at room temperature instead of in a very warm oven. I will have to try that next time. The crumb was pretty nice although a little dense:
If you want to experiment with Desem and don’t want to wait the two weeks for the starter to get going and then another month for it to gain strength, I have a limited amount of Desem for sale on my website. It will be sent as a small piece of dough ball at a very low hydration so it won’t raise while enroute. You can find out more about it at the bottom of the page at:
Click on the picture of the Desem bread and it will take you to another page that tells more about the Desem starter and what you need. You will need Laurel’s Kitchen Bread Book and a good supply of fresh organic Whole Wheat flour plus some really good water and a cool place in your house. Desem is fascinating, especially for those who love Whole Wheat breads.